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QUERIES, COMMENTS and QUESTIONS
(most recent at the end)
Note that / denotes
a new paragraph.
Tell
me if you want your email address hotlinked. Safest email
address to use is Google, gmail.com
5th January, 2008.
Just out of curiosity, went
searching to see if anything re the connection between
Anthony Horden's tree emblem and the Fig tree that used
to stand on the Razor Back, Camden, N.S.W. Would like
your version of the connection, if you can oblige.
and a few days later:
My understanding (and from a senior
driver with Pykes - oldest firm in Australia - both
driver & firm long gone now) was that there was only
one tree - a Morten Bay fig tree on a ridge (on the left
as one traveled south) just before descending the south
side of the Razor back range near Camden. I vaguely
recollect the story, that because the tree bore a
striking resemblance to the tree pictured with AH's trade
emblem (yes, an Oak ,I think?), AH arranged with the land
owners at the Razor Back to erect a huge, long hoarding
sign alongside bearing their motto "while I live
I'll grow". / Later, we were told that some bugger
poisoned the fig tree. It certainly had gone into sharp
decline. Think the remnants were finally cleared away
short years after.
Don Pike ... ex tourist coach driver from the 50s - 60s.
All
information on this subject will be gratefully received.
9th January, 2008.
My name is John Marsden and I live
on the Gold Coast. I am searching for my family history
and have come across this information regarding the
original Anthony Horden:- On 17 July 1841 at Windsor he
had married Harriett, daughter of Samuel Marsden, tanner.
/ All my original ancestors from the 2nd Fleet up to the
1st World War were Tanners or Shoemakers or
Blacksmiths-perhaps all 3 together. / Samuel came out on
the 2nd Fleet and had a son Samuel born on Norfolk Island
in 1910. I am NOT related to The Reverend Samuel
Marsden-my Sam was a private in the NSW Corps. / Would
you know if anyone in the Horden Family is searching
their Family History? / If you do, could you please
forward this email to them as we may be able to assist
each other.
Thank you, John Marsden [ 0416
150242 ] http://www.john-marsden.com/
Anyone
who can help John should contact him via his web site.
11th
March, 2008.
I visited your lovely page to job my
memory on Anthony Horderns, and it did! / What I was
trying to remember was the Xmas display in the 40's after
the war when my mother took my brother and I to see the
Xmas parade down George Street with Santa in his sleigh
on the back of a truck. I always believed that THIS was
the real Santa Claus, and then in the grotto, sweating in
high summer with a thousand other mothers and children,
shuffling through the "caves" to find Santa
again and tell him what we wanted for Xmas. Anthony
Horderns had the real Santa. / I had hoped to find a
reference to Santa and the Xmas display, which inmy day
was not spaceships it was a long tunnel with mechanical
elvesand fairies in papier-mache... and hot as hell in
there, before air conditioning! But then my younger
brother worked out the Santa lie in 1950 and it ended for
us. / As for the tree on the razorback, the article is
exactly right. I actually thought it was an oak tree,
because it was a dead-ringer for the A-H tree (at a
distance). All I can add is that it died around the time
that Anthony Horderns closed its doors... what a shame.
Regards, Bob
Can
anyone add anything as regards the Santa display?
20th
March, 2008
Thank you so much for your web page. It gladdens my
(ageing) heart to read about those long gone days of my
youth, in Sydney, when Anthony Hordern's was a thriving
department store. / How lovely of you to dedicate a page
to your friends. / I'm wondering if you know more about
the Anthony Hordern's oak tree? / My sister and I grew up
at West Pennant Hills. Our father built our house / in
1936, with what materials he could get, during the Great
Depression. / This modest house still stands - renovated,
but not dissimilar from its original state. / To get to
the point - Mum planted an oak tree out the front. I
believe it was one of many seedings (or even acorns?)
Anthony Hordern's gave away to commemorate one of their
significant milestones. / The oak tree is now huge. My
sister recently photographed it, and the old house, and
emailed copies to me. / Neither of us can remember when
Mum planted the tree, but we think perhaps about 1950. /
I do remember their "While I live, I'll Grow"
motto. / I'd love to know what year Anthony Hordern's
distributed those seedlings or acorns and what it was
commemorating. Can you help?
Warm regards, Robyn
Can
anyone shed light on Robyn's query?
15th
April, 2008
Hi, My name is Rachael Smith and I
was recently told a story of my grandfather visiting this
building and the wonder filled him with joy, he only
visited it once as he lived in a small town outside of
Orange. He visited this building because he was told a
story of love and drunkenness misfortune. The story
starts with a stable hand in Cornwall who fell in love
with the wealthy land owners only daughter. Their love
was forbidden so after a year they both eloped to
Australia. On the way over they married and started a new
life assuming a different name. Upon knowing some family
here they acquired a large amount of land in Sydney. Only
to hit some troubles did the young man hit the bottle
pretty hard, and falling on harder times had to sell his
land. He sold this land for a bottle of rum to Anthony
Horden. / As I now know how much land he owned I wonder
if the story is true. So do you have any advice on how I
could find out how Anthony Horden acquired the land? Also
I am told that it was believed that the family was
cursed, and this had something to do with the tree that
is part of their emblem. I can't remember exactly as my
grandfather has now passed on. But when Anthony passed on
so did the tree, well that what I was told.
Any help would be appreciated...
Cheers, Rachael Smith...
P.S I would have loved to seen the
emporium, is sounded wonderful, every child fantasy...
See
message below, from Wen.
13th
May, 2008
Hi, I was researching the AH motto.
'While I live, I grow' and found something useful on your
site (re Camden figtree I vaguely remember), so thanx!
One of your correspondents Robyn, was wondering if the
seedling for a now mighty oak might have come from AH -
well, according to info on www.sydneyarchitecture.com (search for Anthony
Horderns thereon) it may well have as they did give away
hundreds of oak seedlings to mark their centenary
(corroborated from another source too).
Cheers, Wen Dyson
15th
May, 2008
Was delighted to read Wen Dyson's
entry about the oak seedlings. From my reading of the
Sydney Architecture site Wen cited, It seems my mother
obtained one of the thousands of seedlings Anthony
Hordern's gave away in
1938. She must have planted it the same year, two years
after Dad built our house. / Thank you, Wen, for this
info and thank you, John, for creating the Anthony
Horderns' site.
Warm regards, Robyn (Melbourne)
23rd
May, 2008
Great memories of Anthony Horderns
in the 50's! My Mother used to take me as a child into
town and we always visited the store. / We lived in
Waverley (Sydney) and we would catch the tram from the
corner of Arden and MacPherson Streets. Those were the
days where you dressed up because you were 'going into
town'. I loved the tram rides and I would always see a
Fire Engine racing down Elizabeth Street! I can remember
Mum having morning tea in the store and I still have a
Dinky Toy red bus with the Anthony Horderns sticker and
price of 7/6 on it! / They were wonderful days and it's a
great shame that the building was demolished. / Long live
our memories!
Regards, Keith Morris >>
Thanks
for your message, Keith. I have a photo of a tram turning
into Goulburn from Pitt St which I'll soon be loading to
the site. I'm envious of your Dinky red bus, as I had one
and sadly sold it years ago, mint boxed, for $3.50.:(
Wish I'd kept it.
20th
June, 2008
Hi John, it may be of interest to
you that in 1988-89 I made a 48 minute documentary film
on AH with my colleague Mark Stiles. The film is titled
"Universal Provider." In the
process of extensively researching for the film we
discovered approximately 80 glass plate negatives of the
building and its construction, photographs taken by
Arthur Foster. The State Library of NSW has an extensive
collection of Foster images. / The film may still be
available through the Australian Film Commission. It is
in the State Library collection if you wanted to view it
there.
Regards, Mark Jackson
Great
to hear from you, Mark. Maybe you can fill us in as to
how you came to do the documentary, and any anecdotes,
etc., which you can recall.
26th June, 2008
I have many stories associated with doing the research
for the film, as well as insights into the history of the
firm and the family. Your initiative with the web site is
excellent. If you do manage to visit the State Library
make sure you look at the Hordernian magazine collection.
This was a valuable source for our research. There is
also a book published on the family, though you are
probably familiar with it. / If you do get a chance to
see the film I'd be pleased to get your response. It won
a documentary film award when screened in Melbourne at
the annual documentary film festival in 1988 (I think).
It was reviewed on ABC radio at the time, though I am not
aware of print reviews. The film had a public release at
the Chauvel Cinema (AFI Cinema) in Paddington as well as
in Adelaide. It has been screened in NZ and in various
places in the USA.
Regards, Mark
12th
September, 2008
Hi, I was looking thru your site regarding Camden and
thought I'd let you know that tree at the old home was
used AH. Our badges had the tree and our name on them. I
worked at West Ryde shop and was about 15 at the time. I
would go to city with the delivery driver and drop off
goods and pickup others for delivery out west.
Regards, R Willett
Nice
to hear from you, Robert. We'd be happy to hear more!
25th
October, 2008
From: annelevonis@hotmail.com
Hi;
I am researching my family tree; a ggaunt [?] who worked
as cook for the Hordern family. Her name was Bridgette
Hannah Doherty. I have an old recipe book with an address
sticker for Retford Hall, Darling Harbour. This has been
demolished. I do have a couple of photos of it though. I
used to love going to town at Christmas to visit santa
and the displays in the shop. If anyone is interested in
photos I will e mail them. If anyone knows if there is
any sort of emplyee list or suggestions on how I could
find more information.
Anne Levonis
21st
November, 2008
From Jillian
... another thing on the trip to Sydney and I'm thinking
in the same area as the tree was a big globe situated on
the left side going north. In a paddock grey in colour, a
few people say this sounds familiar ...
Thanks
for your letter Jillian. Hopefully someone will come up
with an answer as regards the GLOBE.
30th
January, 2009
From Kerry
Anthony Hordern's Palace Emporium page on "Sydney
Architecture Images":
http://www.sydneyarchitecture.com/GON/GON01.htm
Ian and John,
I enjoyed the pages very much. Ian, did you keep a diary
or go into a hypnotic trance to remember all that stuff?
The "The occasion also saw my very first paid
overtime" really knocked me out".
1st
February, 2009
From Wade & Mandy
We recently purchased a fairly large horse made of
Bakelite and mounted on a swing stand. We are told that
this "rocking horse" was purchased from Anthony
Hordern & Sons in 1938 by people from the NSW Central
West. In the course of researching this rocking horse, we
have been told that it may actually be either a rocking
horse or a carousel type horse, some of which were
displayed throught the Anthony Hordern & Sons store
(emporium). Google
led us to your site and we wonder of yourself or any
former employees or customers of AH & Sons might have
information or recollections about this particular piece
of history. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Here's
a response.
In
Newcastle many years ago I bought a horse that
sounds like this one and I'm stumped to find any
information on it. I would be interested to find out if
we have the same horse. drawn2mel@yahoo.com.au
6th
February, 2009
From Adj Ellis
It is shame to see such an amazing building gone. I have
no memories of such a building as I am only 22 and as a
child would have been distracted by other things in the
city. After stumbling across this site it makes me sad to
think that such a dominant building and a piece of
Sydney's history is gone forever. Taken at the whim of
the developer who made millions of dollars off the site
and couldn't spare a few bucks to at least keep the
façade. / As a student studying Urban Planning at the
University of New South Wales it is things like this that
make me want to try hard to keep buildings like these in
the future. I would hate for any other buildings to be
lost like some of those that are already demolished to my
disgust in the Brewery Site redevelopment in Broadway. I
worry about other buildings like the White Bay power
station too. New buildings can be integrated with old
buildings. This ensures progress is not halted while
history is still retained. Why don't they do this with
more buildings? Because the State is run by
unsophisticated politicians who are tied to developers. /
I am not going to become a maniac planner who denies
applications for children's swings or a new clothes line
in someone's yard but the fate of Sydney's history should
NEVER be decided by politicians who HAVE NO planning
skills (which require some common sense which rarely
politicians seems to have + a five year degree in urban
planning) and especially not developers who are out for
profit.
Sadly,
because the AH building was in a then unfashionable part
of the city, south of the CBD, there was almost nothing
put into print at the time of demolition. I believe that
in part, it was a sacrifice to maintaining a number of
facades in the Haymarket region, and even helped towards
the saving and restoration of both the Capitol Theatre,
and the QVB. Others way disagree, but as someone who
worked closeby for over 20 years and knew many of the
businesses and shopkeepers in the immediate area, I'm
sure there's more than a grain of truth in that thought!
Which reminds me that the most memorable story which came
out of the Pitt Street frontage was the running battle
for custom between two barbershops.
4th
June, 2009
From The Futcher Family
What a wonderful site full of memories to me. / My late
grandfather worked at AH in the 1930s-60s as a window
dresser. / I wish I had listened more to his wonderful
stories about his time there. / It makes me sick to the
stomach seeing all our heritage, both family and building
wise, gone. Where this grand building once stood is now
an eye sore.
Thanks
for your comments, Barbara.
THE
OAK TREE
Definitive details from the 1938 celebration booklet
(which I was given for Christmas; thanks, Greg).
 According
to this book, "... oak trees were planted at
the back of the Hordern shop on Brickfield Hill [where
the original store was located, and the third,
our Emporium], and they were adopted as
symbolic of the progress which Anthony and his
sons felt they would achieve in the world of
commerce. This was the origin of their famous
Trade Mark - The Oak Tree, with its motto: While
I live, I'll grow." You can find a photo of
the Razorback tree
location on Flickr.
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EDITOR CONTACT DETAILS
If you have any queries on the above, email John
at opsbooks
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Acknowledgements:
Maurice, for corrections.
INFORMATION
ALSO WANTED ON SYDNEY TOY SHOPS
ANYTHING (photos,
employee information, catalogues) on the Sydney toy
department store of Walther and Stevenson Ltd, at 395
George Street, which operated from the 1930s to the
1970s. Also similar information on Levenson's Radio (when
they maintained their toy section) at 226 Pitt Street,
Fisher's Toy Shop at Town Hall behind their pharmacy on
George Street, and Hobbyco (prior to 1970) - Your page
editor. New page taking shape!
OTHER LINKS and SOURCES OF INFORMATION
Picman database at State Library of NSW for Anthony Hordern & Sons. This includes
references to collections which I hope to visit and
examine, although if anyone reading this could visit the
Mitchell Library and carry out reseach, we'd be very
grateful. Note there is a collection of Toy Section
school holiday photos from around 1957-1958 listed, but
you can only view in person. There are copyright and not
available online.
Goulburn - Pitt Street
corner, tram from 1953
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/ArchivesWeb/scripts/ExtSearch.asp?SearchTerm=044263
Goulburn - Elizabeth
Street, AH in distance, tram from 1954
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/ArchivesWeb/scripts/ExtSearch.asp?SearchTerm=044275
Here Comes Santa - great
early 1920s [silent] movie clip of Santa, amid huge
crowds, arriving down George Street.
http://australianscreen.com.au/titles/here-comes-santa/clip1/
Mark's 1988 documentary, THE UNIVERSAL PROVIDER;
details at the Australian Film Commission's site.
http://www.afc.gov.au/filmsandawards/filmdbsearch.aspx?view=title&title=UNIVEP&type=shorts
Not a link, but
for those wishing to research information on AH, I
suggest the Sydney Powerhouse Museum library where I've
consulted AH mail order catalogues.
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